"Dan Abel" <dabel[at]sonic.net> wrote in message news:dabel-DEFB1B.10025421052006[at]nnrp-virt.nntp.sonic.net...

(Re: single-vision reading glasses):

- quote -

My wife, Mrs. Adams, has a couple of expensive eyeglass pairs that she
does not use. I thought they were progressives, but it turns out that one
pair are simple reading glasses she got for computer use.

Here are the details -- see if you can make any sense:

Here basic script is
+3.75
+3.75
Add 2.0

The script for "computer glasses" is:
+6.00
+6.00

She is an proud person who has a large computer display screen which
sits a bit beyond her reach on a huge fancy table.

I asked her about the examination for the "computer glasses" and she said
the "doctor*" repeatedly and rapidly asked "which is best, this or this", and
she got confused.

I have tried to explain to her, from 8th-grade general science, about how
focal length is inversely related to lens power, and about how a one-diopter
lens is one with a focal length of one meter, and how one inch is equivalent
to 2.54 centimeters, but she did not take that course, and inversity is
offensive to her. So we never even got so far as the significance "add number",
which I have been told by some "doctors*" is a subjective thing, anyway.

So, like your wife, Mrs. Adams prefers the same pair of eyeglasses for all
tasks, which eyeglasses happen to be "add 2.0" bifocals. Though she needs to
sit before the computer with her head at an awkward angle, she says the
bifocals give her a less blurry image of the computer screen than do the
computer glasses (which actually have much fancier frames).

My dinky little CRT screen sits at 20 inches from my face, and my "add 2.0"
(Zenni) reading glasses work quite perfectly, for that, and most everything on
my desk, which is actually quite narrow. In a pinch, I can use Walgreens
readers, but that is a matter of dumb luck because my implant surgeon was
having good days when he did me. Also, for that reason, I can see everything
else in the room quite sharply by peering over my narrow readers.

--
Dicky

______________
* I don't always actually know who is a doctor. Usually, around here, the phoropter
flip-floppers are mostly home-grown techs. Neither of two excellent phoropter jockeys
I have known were doctors of any sort, and the absolute worst one was. (That
was the one who prescribed "add 2.0" for one eye, and "add 1.5" for the other.)

This is why some of us work hard to create an experience that dissuades
patients from seeing "...the doctor on my insurance plan." It appears
the patient education and the post-sale service were lacking. Don't
write off progressives, yet. If your first car was a lemon, would you
stop driving? Your visual needs may require a reconsideration in the
future.

In article <4eZbg.956$FQ4.647[at]trndny06> ,
"Dick Adams" <bad.addr[at]nonexist.com> wrote:

- quote -


I think it's obvious that *no* glasses are best. My comment was simply
meant to convey that if you *have* to wear glasses, most people with
presbyopia prefer multifocal glasses.



- quote -

"Older people" is a code phrase for "presbyopia".


- quote -


Works for me. Works for you. Of course, we both have IOLs due to
cataract. Not everybody does. For a presbyope with myopia or
hyperopia, reading glasses may not do the trick.


My wife could use reading glasses, but she doesn't want to be carrying
around multiple pairs of glasses and swapping them in and out. So she
wears progressives.

It's kind of funny, really. For 35 years, I wore glasses almost every
waking moment. My wife didn't wear glasses at all. Now, she puts on
her glasses when she gets up and doesn't take them off until she goes
back to bed. I don't normally wear glasses anymore, due to the IOLs. I
only wear them for close work.

--
Dan Abel
dabel[at]sonic.net
Petaluma, California, USA

"Dan Abel" <dabel[at]sonic.net> wrote in message news:dabel-97BBD2.18320820052006[at]nnrp-virt.nntp.sonic.net...

- quote -

Speak for yourself. I don't like eyeglasses or any other kind of eye
prosthesis, intervention, or eye guk. However, given human condition
and the situation with human eyes, I feel that some choices are more
reasonable than others.

With regard to "older people", they, in general, like most everybody else,
don't have the slightest friggin' idea how their eyes work, or don't work,
and can be baffled and buffaloed by most any smooth-talking operator
with a fancy, expensive, high-margin, often-hazardous, solution to the
simplest of their visual problems.

Regarding the adaptation of presbyopic eyes to close work, like reading
and computer-screen viewing, I feel entirely competent (though neither
OD nor MD), to shout from the housetops that reading glasses are the
simplest, cheapest, and most obvious solution.

--
Dicky

In article <mXMbg.2624$p13.2438[at]trnddc07> ,
"Dick Adams" <bad.addr[at]nonexist.com> wrote:


- quote -

Dicky and I like single vision glasses. Most older people don't. It's
a personal preference thing.



- quote -

--
Dan Abel
dabel[at]sonic.net
Petaluma, California, USA

"jo" <huck01[at]juno.com> wrote in message news:1148161224.324827.80050[at]j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

- quote -

Ordinary single-vision reading glasses can be quite good for
computers as well as for reading*, for folks who need them.
You should bake a special pie for the girl at the glass place.

- quote -

If you had some ham, you could have a fine ham sandwich,
if you had some bread.

--
Dicky
__________________
* Of course, they are not too good for lookin' all 'round the
office while you are s'posed to be lookin' at you screen.

Dicky,

It's funny you should comment about progressives and computers. The
sales girl at the glass place kept pushing the progressives on me
because they have the intermediate field for computers. She kept
telling me this over and over, despite the fact that I told her no less
than 6 times I don't need any glasses for the computer and that I don't
wear glasses at home. That wasn't the reason I tried the progressive.
I was concerned about the line in the bifocal interferring w/my vision
- and it does - but am very leery about trying the progressvie again
due to my experience. While I think the idea of progressive lenses is
great, I don't like having to hold my head or turn my head just so in
order to see out of the relatively small viewing field. I'm more
comfortable turning my eyes instead. Of course, if I had the right rx
w/the right progresssive and just got used to them, I'm sure I'd like
them just fine.

Jo

"Dom" <dont[at]spam.me> wrote in message news:446f1718$0$81270$c30e37c6[at]ken-reader.news.telstra.net...


- quote -

Nope! Depth of field and residual accomodative amplitude favor single-
vision eyeglasses for computer use (Zenni's are good).

Only a very small portion of "progressive" lenses is right for the computer,
or other desk work. With the single-vision close-work eyeglasses you can
see anything on your desk, including the computer display, no matter how
you hold your head. Well, if you are totally presbyopic, and require a huge
36" display on the other end of your huge mahogony desk, you might need
bifocals with add+1 uppers and add+2 downers, but with those you could
also see what the crowd at the bubbler is up to, and, in a pinch, drive by day.

Actually, bifocals for computer use are a bad idea, because you have to hold
your head at an unnatural angle. Same, no doubt, for "progressives", though I
cannot speak from personal experience about that. My lady has several pairs
of "progressives" that she does not use, but she does not tell me exactly why.

--
Dicky

Dom,

Thanks so much for the info you gave me. I think I am going to go to
the new eye doc (I've been to them b/4) and see what he says about the
rx. I will decide what to do w/the old doc after I know if I need new
lenses. Either way, I will be in contact w/the old doc. At the least
I feel they should refund my out of pocket expenses. If I end up
needing new lenses, I will get the old ones and return them and ask for
a refund. I doubt they will give me one because on the bottom of the
receipt it says that all custom eye glasses and contact sales are
final.

I don't want to go back to this doc because I've been there three
times. He wants nothing to do w/the office end of things. I don't
necessarily think the problem is the doc, but rather the office people
and the manufacturer. At one point I asked the office girl of they
could have made a mistake in making them and she flippantly said not
possible. My impression is that the office girls (I think one of them
is married to the doc) are SALES people first and foremost. My husband
had his eyes checked there as well. He doesn't wear glasses but like
me, the up close stuff isn't as clear. The doc said over the counter
reading glasses w/be fine for now but the office girl tried to talk him
into progressives!! I wish I had just paid out of pocket for an exam
at the old place to begin with and had gotten my glasses there too.

Unfortunately, I am very put off by the progressives. My sister-in-law
has them and says she can only see out of one specific place on her
glasses. Everything else is off. Maybe in a few years when I get my
eyes checked again (at the old, trustworthy, competent place!!) I will
consider progressives. As for now, if I need new lenses I am going to
get a single, distance lens and just look under them if needed. Where
I need them the most is grocery shopping or mass -- looking distance
then at a list or music. I wear rx sunglasses about 90% of the time.
They are the best. I don't know how people can drive w/out
sunglasses!! As for tv, being at home and stuff I don't wear them; I
never have. Sometimes it's nice that things are quite clear -- then
you can't see how messy the house really is!!

Thanks again for everyone's help. I will let you know what happens.
As for now, I'll just use my old glasses.

Jo

Hi Jo...

jo wrote:
- quote -



- quote -

Sounds like a problem either with centration (alignment) of the
progressive lenses (more likely), or maybe with adaptation (less likely)
or a combination of both.

I went back. They said they would exchange them for a
- quote -

Distance vision in a bifocal should be clear pretty well straight away.
After two weeks there's no more 'getting used to them'.

- quote -

It's true that dry eyes can cause vision to fluctuate and be hazy but
your description of your problems doesn't seem to match this as a cause.
Did the artificial tears help you see more clearly? If not, then dry eye
wasn't the cause of your problem.

During the next week I noticed that when I
- quote -

This indicates that the centres of the bifocal lenses are not aligned
with your eyes. It also suggests that your lens material may be
polycarbonate plastic or some other lower quality optical material
(google 'abbe value') - but this second point is a guess on my part.

I went back and told the doc. He said I was
- quote -

He meant that when you look through a lens off-centre, distortions
inherent in the lens create a different focus - usually detrimental but
in your case advantageous due to the fact that the central focus isn't
right to begin with.

He did his checking with the machine lenses stuff
- quote -

Sounds like she is blindly following company policy but she isn't
realising that you have had a genuine problem right from the start and
you're not trying to take advantage of them.

They were going to charge me for a new rx, but being the vocal
- quote -

They were going to charge you? Unbelievable. Don't they have any kind of
warranty, or after sales service?

I have had the new glasses for about 3 weeks.
- quote -

Combination of either (1) wrong Rx to begin with, (2) polycarbonate or
high index material, and/or (3) mis-alignment of the optical centres of
the lenses.

Does the fact
- quote -

Probably not - bifocals are pretty straightforward to manufacture and
get used to, especially compared to progressives.

The bifocal part is
- quote -

Getting single vision lenses and looking underneath them is always an
option, but progressives are the ultimate solution to give you the most
versatile vision (and of course they have no annoying line). However
progressives must be made precisely and are not forgiving of any error
in the measuring and manufacturing process. I ALWAYS recommend
progressive to my patients (rather than bifocals) because I know my
staff have the expertise to make them accurately. If they're not made
accurately then you'll experience narrow zones of clear vision.

By the way, if you are a computer user, forget bifocals, progressives
are better (or take them off).

If the new doc says the rx is correct, could the manufacturer
- quote -

Well yes but the other doctor's office should have detected this in
their routine checking and rejected the lenses before they were ever
given to you. In theory.

What should I do w/regards to the $175 I am out
- quote -

Best to ask your new doc after you've worked out what the original
problem is. But to me the glasses don't do the job you bought them for
so that's surely grounds for a refund.

If I call them now, they will realize they did not
- quote -

It sounds like you picked the wrong eye doctor! Please don't be put off
progressives (or bifocals) as they can be very useful; it sounds like
your problem is with the eye doctor and his office rather than the type
of lenses. The moral of the story is to go to the place you trust rather
than the place that's cheapest!

PS: Please take the advice of both Otis & Aceman with a grain of salt -
they probably mean well but are full of misinformation & half-truths.

Dom