"Dave Bell" <dbell[at]TheSPAMFREEBells.net> wrote

- quote -

Defects that "jump" are usually lenticular. Corneal variations are smooth,
lenticular variations are often discontinuous.

-MT

"Simon Dean" <sjdean[at]simtext.plus.com> wrote

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Technically it is astigmatism, literally "lack of a point".

But classic "astigmatism" assumes just two major meridians ("football"
shape) so glasses are limited to a best approximation of the real surface.

Use Google to search (images) on "corneal topography" and you'll see that
the normal corneal surface is much more complex than a football. Two areas
of cornea will have different curvature, but more importantly they may not
be exactly "co-axial". If they aren't coaxial, their images form in slightly
different places, eg diplopia.

- quote -

Very possible. It the pinhole eliminates it, bingo.

If so, then brighter room lights are about the only home remedy. Gas perm
contacts might work exceedingly well. Low-dose pilocarpine (or Alphagan-P)
are sometimes used to stimulate miosis.

-MT

On Thu, 5 Jul 2007, Simon Dean wrote:

- quote -


As I have used a pinhole, the trick is to move it around, watchign for an
abrupt change in the image you see. If you have a crease or other defect
in the cornea, the pinhole should cause a jump, from the normal, main
position of the LED or text to the displaced position, as you cross the
defect.

Dave

Mike Tyner wrote:
- quote -

F'in A. Give that man a star. Pinhole, though difficult to see through,
seems to work quite well.

Staring at an LED on my computer, it goes away in bright light, comes
back when the lights are off, looks fine through a pinhole.

Sooo.... Corneal Diplopia though, isn't astigmatism though and you don't
fix it with glasses? I'll have to look at what happens when looking
through a pair of sunglsses.

I am obviously wondering now about whether any of this could be
translated to my previous issue, of black text on white paper. Could the
white paper be blurry and ghosting (over the text) instead of the text
blurring? Will the LCD monitor be kicking out so much light and the
contrast so great compared to paper, that we have a "light on gets rid
of corneal diplopia" situation?

Cheers
Simon

"Simon Dean" <sjdean[at]simtext.plus.com> wrote

- quote -

Yes. If you're younger, it's usually corneal and if it's acquired after 50,
it's probably lenticular.

- quote -

Well you've described a couple of symptoms that are difficult to explain
optically (text jumps out, every ripple more pronounced) but I'm pretty sure
the diplopia is more mundane.

- quote -

Corneal diplopia should be more noticeable in dim light with hi-contrast,
bright targets on a dim background.

So, have you made a pinhole and tried it yet?

-MT

Mike Tyner wrote:
- quote -

Incidentally, any vertical monocular diplopia I have, is usally when im
looking at a bright light on a dark background.

eg, white credits on a black screen, or the green dots on a "volume
control" of a tv, a a small bright power led on a computer or similar.
That to me is when it's noticable.

Cya
Simon

Mike Tyner wrote:
- quote -


This worries me now. I've never tried pinholes, and as you say,
monocular diplopia can usually be explained by ocular abberations? The
fact he's talking about stuff happening in the back of the brain makes
me wonder if he really suspects that my vision issues are neurological -
but that he just doesn't know what they are.

Cya
Simon

"Simon Dean" <sjdean[at]simtext.plus.com> wrote

- quote -

I thought yours disappeared with a pinhole? If it disappears thru a pinhole,
it's optical, not neurological.

Corneal diplopia disappears with a gas-perm contact, lenticular does not.

-MT

In article <5evjhgF39hql8U1[at]mid.individual.net> ,
Simon Dean <sjdean[at]simtext.plus.com> wrote:

- quote -

Why thanks!
- quote -

I completely understand that sentiment. I went through years until I was
diagnosed. It certainly helped to explain many things I had been
experiencing and helped to justify to others that I HAD something when I
was afraid that it was all in my head. It was a relief at first. But,
as I mention below, it can also become a catch all for anything that's
wrong. I have spent almost as many years trying to prove I don't have MS
(unfortunately the tests always come back positive).

- quote -

There is more than one way to skin a cat. I may not be following the
present "conventional" method (that has really only been around for a
decade--that's how long MS medications have been FDA approved), but I
feel that I am on top of it. In fact I was entered in a study for people
with MS whose MRIs show improvement (ie. lesions getting smaller or
disappearing). I see an acupuncturist regularly, watch my diet and
exercise. I have learned to cope around my symptoms--which are mostly
visual and fatigue. I don't take medications. I do have an MRI every
year or so (that was the deal I made with my doctor whose job it is to
prescribe the most advanced medications available.) Others may chose to
follow the conventional protocol. That's each person's prerogative and
everyone has to do what they feel is right for them. There is no single
approach, I believe.

- quote -

It really depends on your symptoms. An MRI is a photograph, it doesn't
spit out a diagnosis. Sometimes there are no physical abnormalities to
explain symptoms. Sometimes the more we worry about something being
wrong, like seeing white spots on an MRI, the more likely we are to
experience adverse symptoms and/or feel sick. If you have insurance or
if you can afford to pay for MRIs every year, they are not going to
physically harm you--but on the other hand focusing on the scans may be
deflecting your attention from what's really going on and addressing the
true cause.

- quote -

It is really hard not to worry about what other people think of you,
including (especially?) doctors, but you really have to do what is best
for yourself in consultation with a doctor you trust. Have you ever kept
a journal of your symptoms and when they happen? Why do you think a
particular symptom may be happening at a particular time?

Sometimes there are emotional things we don't want to deal with and our
bodies make us feel sick or in pain so we concentrate on those symptoms
instead. That doesn't mean that those symptoms aren't real, that there
aren't things that are physically wrong like disturbed vision or pain,
but just that our minds are incredibly clever in keeping us focused on
our bodies when it is our psyches that need healing Those kinds of
chronic disturbances cannot be explained with an MRI scan.

Best of luck to you. You'll figure it out and make the right decision
for yourself.

--
~RT

RT wrote:
- quote -

I've just read it all.... What a load of crap... :-)

Nah, it's great. You've even answered one of the things I was thinking.

Im in no way trying to suggest I have MS, or even wishing for it, but,
to me there would be a great thing in having a diagnosis of "something".
To me, it would be closure.

It's a difficult thing for me to talk about, because any of my symptoms
are probably so non-descript and pale in significance compared to anyone
who has been diagnosed with MS. But I do have a tendency to believe that
I am unusually sensitive and pick up on anomalies and want an answer. Im
still seeking a referral to an ENT specialist to find out why after six
years, my throat is still dry and my sinuses are still congested.

- quote -

Some people can read that, and draw parallels in anything. If I wanted I
could read that and think "vision first", that's common with me!

Hopefully I don't think like that. I experience something, and look to
medical science to explain it. Just a shame someone mentioned
demylination - then I start thinking, OK, vision, sometimes my words
mess up, sometimes I bump into things while walking, drop things Im
carrying, and I already have another autoimmune condition called
hypothyroidism.

But then the rationalist in me says OK, I've never dropped a pint,
everybody muddles their words up, and so what I bump into things, I
busted my knee up, maybe Im just getting used to walking again - I can
drive fine.

Still there's something at the back of mind thinking, am I just being
too sensitive? Is there something lurking there? How can I make sure if
there is something there, then I can be on top of it?

By the way, my vision when Im outside, things appear more washed out and
greyish - a pair of sunglasses brings everything back to life. so for
me, my vision. It's duller but brighter.


- quote -

So an MRI with no issues doesn't indicate you don't have it, and even if
there are abnormalities, doesn't indicate you do. Just symptoms then?

Did your MRI show any white spots? I think I had about ten dots
spattered through my brain. Doc reckoned it could be some blood vessels
and gave a fancy name for it.

- quote -

(Note to self: there can be many vision issues with MS can't there?)

- quote -

I'll tell you my first answer... jump for joy. My second answer,
probably nothing, unless someone gave me a definitive answer, then I'd
probably say "Ok, good, something we can work on".

My answer now? Not sure, I have just read what you say further on about
being labelled as your disease and anything that happens is a symptom of
that.

- quote -

I hope Im not like that. All I know is how Im feeling, what my reactions
are, and what I do, then look towards medical science to try and explain
it. Trouble is, most of what I have is either, unexplainable, or the
answer I have didn't actually explain the situation. Like sometimes,
when i don't take my thyroxine, I feel more alert.

Seems an odd thing to do, to treat someone for MS when they havent been
given a diagnosis - just in case.

Thing is did they know you had it and were just being kind, or were they
just unsure? And given how reliable everything is, how can you be sure
you actually even have it now?

I guess our whole society is geared more towards preventative medicine.
Unfortunately that can't really work can it, unless you have some idea
of just what you're supposed to be preventing?

(Note to group: I can sense my politicalness rearing up, and I'll start
being unkind to various people, so Im quitting there)

- quote -

This is the bit of your post that is so true. It must be awful for you
to fight the doctors at every stage. And I think I have it bad!

How can not wanting this though, be reconciled with wanting to be on top
of it?

- quote -

I think I'd like to make sure Im on top of it. I think that's all. I
mean, I've had one MRI, I'd like maybe to keep it in check, just see
what's happening over the next couple of years so that if I did have
more symptoms, I hope it would be fairly easy to get a referral from my doc.

I get the feeling that if I was to "break the cycle" there, but then
developed symptoms in four, five years time or something, that it would
be immensely difficult to get anyone to listen.

Cheers
Simon